Is political correctness in our modern society, being taken too far or have we got the balance right? What are your views?

I think PC trys to ensure that there is no discrimination and people are not offended. Censorship is by the state and is intended to stop people knowing a fact or information

There is discrimination in daily life, for instance, supermarkets give spaces over to Parent and Child parking, if all these spaces are taken, do they drive to the next supermarket to find an empty space?....no, they park anywhere, they have choice, I don't. The W.I. women only, men are excluded. PC on the other hand was invented to keep everything sweet, ..it might offend, you can't have a " page 3 " calendar on display...it might offend, the list goes on, myself I don't give a Rodent's I my remarks offend, my answer is...grow up

Celtwitch, is that a politically correct thing to say?

Another aspect of PC that I know we all have opinions about is swearing. I feel that Admin is ultra PC in the way it deals with this. Here are my views and suggestions:-

1) We are all grown up, indeed being Silver Surfers we all grew up a generation ago.

2) I believe that most of us are not foul-mouthed, indeed the number of people on the site who would count as foul-mouthed will be very small.

3) The evidence available to me says that most of us use the milder swear words from time to time.

4) Here's my own use of swear words:-
a) The four-letter f-word (I mean the stronger f-word) and the c-word I don't use at all.
b) The three shorter and longer b-words I use occasionally.
c) The sh-word I also use sometimes, but I also believe that English needs a way to describe an essential function. Does anyone really believe that "going to the bathroom" is a better use of language?
d) The other four-letter f-word, f*rt, also describes an essential human function, and this word has returned to everyday use in about the last decade. I use this word, though I sometimes also say 'breaking wind'.
e) Much the same can be said about the four-letter p-word.
f) I do use the four-letter a-word, usually in the expression "pain in the a**e". Indeed I believe I used this expression soon after joining Silver Surfers and it was censored. The rest of the message survived so it must have been a manual edit.
g) Once in a blue moon I might use the four-letter d-word.
h) Is the three-letter t-word regarded as acceptable these days?

My Suggestions
1) Editing or deletion of messages containing swear words should stop.
2) Admin should still keep an eye, in the interests of decency.
3) Some appropriate action if a member is frequently foul-mouthed could be taken. How about:-
a) first time - a gentle request
b) next time and following the gentle request, a warning
c) for another offence, expulsion, or temporary suspension?

These are only one person's ideas. I don't expect general agreement.

I can only apologise if editing destroys the sense of any part of this.

Hello KEITH_WL

Thank you for your suggestions.

The one difference that our Silversurfers Forum and Facebook page have to almost any other community is the lack of swearing and use of words that some may find unpleasant and unnecessary.

Our community pages are designed to foster friendships, based on trust, honesty, integrity and loyalty and is underpinned by these values.

We get regular feedback saying how much people enjoy being part of our community such as this left yesterday 'I too love the site no foul language no aggressive comments great!'

Whilst we don't tolerate swearing, and reserve the right to remove any posts which we feel may offend others, we do feel that in some cases PC has overstepped common sense in the society we live in. We try to take a balanced view and accept that it is difficult to please everyone all of the time.

We have an automatic filter which highlights words that our not deemed pleasant to use on Silversurfers. Yes, we are all grown ups, however with so many words available to use in the English language there are always alternatives to use.

Also, there is always the Private Chat option for conversations that you don't wish other to see.

There are plenty of other Forums and Facebook pages that don't worry about offending others and we are shocked on a daily basis at how negative and destructive conversations can become.

We are a very small team and try and do our best to ensure that Silversurfers remains a place where people feel comfortable and safe to visit and this will always remain our top priority.

With very best wishes, and hope you enjoy your weekend
Sally 🙂

Thank you for the detailed response, Sally. I hope it was clear from my post that I am no fan of truly foul language and that it was principally a plea to move the boundaries a bit. As described, I personally only use the milder words, and those not often. However I see no harm in the occasional use of expressions like "pain in the a**e" and it is true that almost anyone is likely to use the word "f*rt" these days - which was certainly not so in my youth or even my middle age. Boundaries do move anyway and I believe that my suggestions are more in the spirit of adapting to the changes than in driving them.
Keith

I have to agree with Lionel that moving the boundaries a little could help when describing some issues. I would hope no-one would set out to be deliberately offensive and do appreciate that a number of people feel safe in using this site, but surely some of the words Lionel has suggested are no longer as offensive as they would have been when we where young. Many are now in the Oxford English dictionary!

Sorry Keith and Lionel, obviously got a little muddled - Lionel should read Keith, my fault for watching a thunderstorm at the same time and not concentrating.

I think that on Silversurfers (we must be protected from swear words at all cost, we are all highly sensitive OAP's) the censor is rather less PC and more of a 'Parochial Curmudgeon.'

Lionel the younger generations have been being manipulated in several ways, not just political correctness, and free speech.

Health and safety also has a lot to answer for. Yes I know there is a need for some H&S but it has got ridiculous these days. From a very early age they are taught that all sorts of things are scary and should be avoided. These are normal things in life which we all used to learn about when we played games and so on. My granddaughter was not allowed to play chasing games at school in case someone fell over! All men are probably paedophiles, and even women probably want to take you away to goodness knows where. I think it is all designed to create a society most of whom will not question anything and do as they are told by those in charge.

As an aside, well done to our Olympians who have had to guts and determination to compete and win medals. We want more people like this in all areas of life.

Boots, I agree with both Lionel and yourself on many of the PC issues but I know from experience the HSE are often blamed for H&S issues they (or the Government) have not introduced but that may have arisen because we have become a far more ligatious society. That makes people nervous thus 'Peanut Butter" has to state 'may contain peanuts'. A further example is the bus company that were sued when the tour operator pointed out there were seat belts but didn't state you had to wear them and were then sued after a minor shunt and a person hit their head! As a society we have, as both you and Lionel have noted, become incapable of using our own common sense without being told what to do and if something doesn't go to plan look for someone to blame and I believe such problems been influenced by the State, they certainly look for scapegoats.

We were lucky to grow up as well rounded as we have. We fell over in the playground, ate dirt and used our imagination to amuse ourselves although I do have to admit that my father wouldn't allow me to watch Quatermass!

I wonder how old you were, Jeanmark, when your father wouldn't allow you to watch Quatermass. There is a difference between a parent being cautious about when a child may do something and Society imposing blanket rules.

By the way, in our tiny, safe town, at around the age of eleven, I watched Quatermass at my grandparents' neighbours (we had no television) then walked home on my own, about a mile, at around midnight. My family was a very caring one, but it was regarded as normal. They wouldn't have left me alone in a house overnight. The logic might seem strange but nobody thought it so.

Well Keith, I was young and my father was trying to protect me from having nightmares. This was from a man who had a very traumatic childhood as an orphan in 1912 Glasgow. But I agree there is a great difference between being a caring parent and society imposing blanket rules. I think we are all agreed, PC has gone too far but we risk blaming the state for everything when it is often people themselves. I believe Lionel has given good examples. When my niece became upset at my sister not cleaning everything with bacterial wipes, my sister pointed out that she had brought her and her siblings up without them and they were all healthy so what was the problem! We all appear to have survived the trials and tribulations of childhood only to be told we don't understand risk.

Crazy, isn't it? We are the ones who do understand risk, who assess it with common sense and estimate it. One of the worst mistakes of modern society is black and white thinking - risk/not risk. We would be more inclined to think "risk 20% of a bad outcome, broken leg if it occurs" or "risk 70% of a bad outcome, cut finger if it occurs" and then decide whether to give it a go.

Follow-up: In retrospect I think my views on risk as presented are over-precise. Risk 70% would be more convincing as "fairly high risk"< the other one perhaps as "fairly low risk". Etc.

I think assessing risk from a professional perspective is necessary and why we do need the HSE, but for 'normal' day to day living common sense should kick in but doesn't appear to. As for being PC that often has nothing to do with risk!

I was responding to your comment about risk in this conversation, Jeanmark. In any case I firmly believe that the attitudes behind PC (mustn't risk offending) and over the top H&S (mustn't risk injury) have much in common, being driven by black and white thinking.

I won't argue with that Keith and like you I feel so many things appear driven by black and white thinking (is that non-PC)? In reality things usually fall in various shades of grey and I don't mean 50!

Yes, exactly my opinion.

Depends on how you define free speech but I don't think PC is about Politics, I prefer the term Polite Correctness - that's what most of us were brought up to follow. I do believe it has gone too far.

Political Control or State Censorship or sweep it under the carpet,ignore it,look the other way all these can mean the same, most people just can't handle the truth so lets not tell them and call it PC !

I still don't agree it is Politics or State Censorship and what do you mean "most people just can't handle the truth so lets not tell them and call it PC". What has 'manhole cover' got to do with truth, its a term used to describe an object but is now considered non-PC. There are some terms that are no longer appropriate to use and fall under being PC as they can cause hurt and distress but I have to agree somethings have gone too far. However, one thing hasn't changed under the PC umbrella - a single woman is a 'Spinster' while a single man always remains Mister, surely thats not PC!

My comment wasn't meant to include manholes and other such triva but the more serious side of our society like being called a Racist for flying the English flag, comments on stopping immigration you can be called racist.
My point being is the racist umbrella comes out every time to stop people from commenting ,I don't agree with racism at all but somethings need to be addressed ,the government dont tell us the facts for reason I stated,we can't handle the truth and neither can the Government so nothing gets done.
PC is overused and together with the E.C.H.R makes it all a pathetic joke !

I don't disagree totally with your comments although I've never experienced anyone being called a racist for flying the English flag, I've only read inaccurate reports by the news media. I have to be honest, I've never had the desire to fly any flag in my garden, too noisy when windy. I do agree the PC card is raised too often but I'm not convinced it is always by the Government. As for the European Courts - enough said.

Well said although 'speaking ones mind' can often be misinterpreted and cause unintended offence.

If something needs to be said, and if someone needs to be put in their place, then ballcocks to PC.
No-one has a right not to be offended. If you are so sensitive that you can't cope with criticism, perhaps you should consider taking holy orders?

While I agree with the first part, CeltWitch, the logic of your statement "If you are so sensitive that you can't cope with criticism, perhaps you should consider taking holy orders?" defeats me.

I agree KEITH_WL, I can't quite understand the statement made by celtwitch. If someone is upset at someone speaking 'their mind' why automatically assumed someone is sensitive to criticism. You can use a derogatory term to describe someone without being critical although I agree the person may be sensitive to the use of such a term.

Taking 'holy orders' would have the effect of insulating you from the cruel and nasty world, in which people sometimes say things that might offend.

"Taking 'holy orders' would have the effect of insulating you from the cruel and nasty world" - that is a remarkable statement and you're usually better informed than that.
Keith

I think it means whatever the government wants it to be,so I think its become a form of State sponsored censorship, we can't say anything about too much immigration into the country because they say thats being racist, fly our English flag in your own garden is racist to none English people and I could go on,so I think PC should really mean is Political Control.

Perhaps when we vote out of the EU on Thursday and close our borders things might revert to how they used to be, no PC, just our good British manners and with free speech.

Well said Joan Fraser and I agree we need to loosen up a bit with regard to political correctness. My husband will hold a door open for anyone regardless of gender because he was taught manners as a child. However, some months ago he held the door open for a young lady to walk though and was accused of sexism and being non-PC - he let the door close on her as he didn't want to offend. She then open the door and shouted out that he was a rude oaf, his response "You can't have it both ways lady" and walked on.

PC has gone way too far, as has bureaucracy, also Health and Safety. There's a remark attributed to Martin Luther that man is such a creature that if he falls off his horse on the right-hand side then he'll make sure next time to fall off on the left.

Totally agree with your last few words--- we could usefully think in terms of being sensitive or thoughtful to other people's needs?---If only we could all adopt this what a happy world it could be!!!

we could usefully think in terms of being sensitive or thoughtful to other people's needs?
well we could do that and most people tend to do just that .
how ever you can get a crowd off people who tend to think that the local area is theirs to use as they please , this could be a crowd off youngsters , or football fans , drug users etc .
those things we can as a community generally deal with , at one stage we could trust the local council and police to assst with the problem .
thats not the case today , political correctness has destroyed common sense and taken the trust away from the public .
i will give each person their rights and respect that in return i expect the same back , if thats not to be the case im afraid YOU change my attitude and if that attidude is not correct from a polital stand point then i should change my politics , not my attitude ?

You seem to have the more measured viewpoint in this matter. It's easy to dismiss political correction as a step towards madness, but unless you've travelled in someone's shoes, you cannot possibly imagine the damage done by 'insensitive remarks, thinking and behaviour'. Unless you are just concerned with protecting your own hinterland, being thoughtful towards another's feelings, and responding in kind to that, should surely be 'hotwired' into our human psyche.. agree, that sometimes this can go to the extreme, but that is usually the depth of someone's experiences that has made them so 'defensive...'.

I was about to reply but then thought any view on this subject might be flagged as inappropriate!

Oh how I agree.

its not a marxist controlled state , theirs a vidio on google that shows how the russians dealing with their own problems , and a oxford union debate on china , real eye openers and we are allowed to make jokes , the irish you have to love they can laugh at then selfs , their culture is in their music the launguage their generosity their poetry but its strongest in each and every heart , they are our true neibours a enemy and friend much the same as the scots and welsh .
all off which we co exist with , we the english were forged as a nation with their participation and wouldent exist without it ?
so do what they do carry the strength hope and faith and right of your cause in your heart and be prepare to defend it as our neighbours have . i dont think the pc crowd have the will and stregth off the roman army , they gave up with the scots found it difficult with the welsh , wouldnt consider taking on the irish , and although they took control off the english tribes i dont think they could call the exercise a sucess . were ot being forced to accept anything we never have and i doubt we every will , we dont need to be told how to behave we already know any one who thinks we need telling may be making a mistake ?

In some ways PC is good as I think we have become a much more tolerant and fair society however it has gone completely over the top where nobody dare comment (including the media) for fear of breaking the law or ridicule. having said that with the internet we do have incredible freedom of speech. The UK is probably the best country in the world for freedom of speech

How much I agree with you Mal. We are gradually being controlled more and more of our rights eroded. The latest thing I read was about in large companies where there are people of different religions etc that any food heated by members of staff for their lunch or whatever should not be anything that may upset someone else, no sausage rolls for instance in case it upsets a muslim or someone who wants their meat to be halal. This is not law as such yet, but a suggestion by a group that can influence government policy. The laugh is when we were on holiday in Israel,(another non pork eating people) there were butchers shops selling pork, bacon etc etc all in the open for anyone who wanted to buy it.